RealmRPGer: Yo, you working on SpriteWrite or what?
Nobuyuki BWAA: yes
RealmRPGer: Cause if you don't work faster, I'm gonna have to make a little something on my own
Nobuyuki BWAA: be my guest
RealmRPGer: Well, that's good
Nobuyuki BWAA: just don't steal all my ideas
RealmRPGer: I'd hate to beat a dead horse, is all
RealmRPGer: I can hardly remember what features it had
RealmRPGer: Only thing I can remember is an "fade to color" thing which was pretty cool
Nobuyuki BWAA: http://www.total-klik.net/boards_thread.asp?board=6&topic=195
RealmRPGer: oh yeah, that's right. you hang around the new total-klik now
RealmRPGer: hrmmmmmm, bitmap editing in VB. Never tried it. I'd imagine it to be a lot slower than in C++, unless there's something similar to memcpy
Nobuyuki BWAA: LockBits
RealmRPGer: hrmmm. Not exactly the same thing, but it does help
Nobuyuki BWAA: use the marshal object to access memory directly
RealmRPGer: This reminds me of something I had to do in a class (CS260). The prof was able to do some insane work with the speed of that.
Nobuyuki BWAA: but I really don't need it because I'm not doing per pixel operations
Nobuyuki BWAA: at least not yet
Nobuyuki BWAA: that's a future program I'll be working on
RealmRPGer: Ah, yeah. Working with .NET is a bit different
Nobuyuki BWAA: which is blending modes
Nobuyuki BWAA: for per pixel operations I'll be calling the Marshal object
Nobuyuki BWAA: which allows direct access to memory
Nobuyuki BWAA: but it will be very very limited
Nobuyuki BWAA: I don't want to explode things
RealmRPGer: But I'm working with it a lot now. I have a tile map editor and a ZSNES raw video dump to avi converter.
Nobuyuki BWAA: ok
RealmRPGer: Eh, I directly draw onto the bitmap in my ZSNES converter
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'm not interested in working low level shit
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'm interested in making my ideas into programs
Nobuyuki BWAA: so I get no hard on for geek code talk
Nobuyuki BWAA: in fact
RealmRPGer: Well, I have to create an image from rgb data, so there's really no other way to do it
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'm somewhat enraged by the amount of hoops you must jump through to do anything in C++
RealmRPGer: lol
Nobuyuki BWAA: (hint: that means don't talk to me about doing all this junk 'the hard way')
Nobuyuki BWAA: :B

RealmRPGer: I find that funny, because C++ is considered perfect for games because their moto is efficiency over... well, anything
Nobuyuki BWAA: efficiency in execution
Nobuyuki BWAA: not in coding
RealmRPGer: Hey, I'm USING .NET because I'm trying to do it the easy way. But I couldn't figure out any other way to load that data
Nobuyuki BWAA: that's why VB is known as a Rapid Application Development tool
Nobuyuki BWAA: and now that it compiles to MSIL, it's as powerful as any .net language
RealmRPGer: I'm a designer by trade, so I like to do as little coding as possible...while still having everything be "perfect"
RealmRPGer: Well, I'm used to C++, so C# is my alternative. Sounds like all the commands are the same between all the .NET langauges, anyway. I have to marshall and lock bits, too.
RealmRPGer: well, I don't marshall, but I could
RealmRPGer: I've been wanting to create a particle effects editor, tho.
RealmRPGer: I found out that I'm really interested in special effects
Nobuyuki BWAA: you don't need the marshal, you can use unsafe pointers
RealmRPGer: right, and that's what I did =)
RealmRPGer: It was easier
RealmRPGer: Ooo. You have a line interpolator. I was just thinking about something like that today when going over the particle editor. Particle emitters should move smoothly, of course
Nobuyuki BWAA: the interpolation I plan on using for at least one of the programs is cubic spline
RealmRPGer: "infinite undo" hah. You're lucky your program only draws lines. =/ Otherwise you wouldn't have that luxary =p
RealmRPGer: I'm still discontent about my level editor's undo
Nobuyuki BWAA: infinite undo isn't as hard as it sounds
Nobuyuki BWAA: I keep a vector array of the entire series of strokes, the limit is your memory
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'll have to check and see how much memory this actually takes
RealmRPGer: my elipse doesn't rotate =/
Nobuyuki BWAA: ok
RealmRPGer: Oh, you have hold both keys down. weird
RealmRPGer: Yeah, like I said. Infinite undo isn't hard if you only have one thing to undo
Nobuyuki BWAA: I still don't follow
RealmRPGer: But when you allow the user to create and delete dots, rotate and scale them, etc, etc, it becomes harder to make an undo
Nobuyuki BWAA: not really
RealmRPGer: IF you can store all these actions as objects, it's easy enough
Nobuyuki BWAA: I do
Nobuyuki BWAA: like I said
Nobuyuki BWAA: it's like vector
RealmRPGer: But in .NET 1.1, a lot of functionality didn't exist
RealmRPGer: such as vectors...
Nobuyuki BWAA: I don't believe that
RealmRPGer: Managed C++
Nobuyuki BWAA: whenever you draw something in GDI+ it's a vector until you paint it on screen
RealmRPGer: C++ has a vector class which managed C++ didn't have. You had to import it as a non garbage class, which meant it wasn't an object
Nobuyuki BWAA: if you keep track of the arguments to re-render the thing each subsequent frame then it's still a vector
RealmRPGer: I was using openGL
RealmRPGer: Because the GAME used openGL
Nobuyuki BWAA: it's only when you rely on the bitmap itself to get the pixels is it a raster
Nobuyuki BWAA: anyways.
Nobuyuki BWAA: blah blah blah.
Nobuyuki BWAA: sorry for being so rude, but like I said
RealmRPGer: lol
Nobuyuki BWAA: "so what"
RealmRPGer: Well, I could definately do it in .NET 2.0, but it didn't exist back then.
RealmRPGer: Just saying
RealmRPGer: you're lucky
Nobuyuki BWAA: only thing that didn't really exist then was buffered graphics constructs
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'm not lucky
Nobuyuki BWAA: I planned on not switching until 2.0
Nobuyuki BWAA: because .net was stupid until then
RealmRPGer: They added a lot of things, trust me
RealmRPGer: Maybe not in VB. Who knows about that
Nobuyuki BWAA: I don't have to trust you, I read the docs
RealmRPGer: Well, you didn't try to implement DirectX in 2.0 using a 1.1 tutorial, so... That was a bit of a headache
Nobuyuki BWAA: yeah, I don't care
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'm sorry, you're not getting the idea
RealmRPGer: guess not
Nobuyuki BWAA: I don't care about all the programming crap you do
Nobuyuki BWAA: I apologize for feigning interest and not being direct up until now
Nobuyuki BWAA: also, I apologize if you feel that I should reciprocate the interest you seem to have in my project
RealmRPGer: Well, you're skewing things the way you want them. It wasn't technically about programming, but rather changes.
RealmRPGer: You're saying you don't have an interest in your own project?
Nobuyuki BWAA: no
RealmRPGer: Well, that's too bad
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'm saying I have no interest in your own coding endeavors or whatever it was you had to do in CS or whatever
RealmRPGer: These projects were of my own free will
Nobuyuki BWAA: you ask me how the program's going and then you talk about your own stuff
Nobuyuki BWAA: and so to be polite I feign interest a little while
RealmRPGer: Because I can relate, and therefore try to help you
Nobuyuki BWAA: but it seems like you just asked me as an excuse to talk about your stuff man
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'll be honest, if you really did want to help, I appreciate it
RealmRPGer: Well, I didn't
Nobuyuki BWAA: but you didn't say nothing about any of something interesting pertaining to actually "how" to do it, just talk about tech geek bullshit quite unrelated, like shooting your mouth off about stuff like how the .net framework 1.1 was a piece of crap (which I agree that it was)
Nobuyuki BWAA: but I don't care anything about that or most programming crap in general. I care about creativity
RealmRPGer: Well, you said you weren't interested in the geeky stuff...
Nobuyuki BWAA: and the only thing that interests me about programming is easier ways to achieve my goal
RealmRPGer: I only see it as a means to an end
RealmRPGer: I don't program for fun
Nobuyuki BWAA: which for example if you wanted to talk interesting, would be how you accomplished [x], rather than "you're lucky you only have to do [x]" and pretend you're talking down to me and crap
Nobuyuki BWAA: and by [x] I mean something pertaining you really think would help me out
Nobuyuki BWAA: rather than something you can just brag about
RealmRPGer: Well, if you don't wanna hear about any coding stuff, pretty much the only other thing I can say is that I did something, and hope you'll ask me how I do it.
Nobuyuki BWAA: well, I will, if you ever give me any indication you ever worked on anything I'd have an interest or need to get your help with -- but I'm not sure if you will or won't, chances are you won't if you haven't already, because I went and told you off
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'm just interested in getting my ideas working, man. I'm not interested in..... programming talk like I said unless you had some idea on how to do it better that I haven't already done that doesn't involve pulling my nut hairs out with tweezers
RealmRPGer: I s'pose you're right about that.
Nobuyuki BWAA: programming talk for the sake of it really kinda gets under my skin unless it mutually encourages new ideas
RealmRPGer: I try to grab snippets of code that other people did.
RealmRPGer: Like how somebody already wrote a bitmap to avi converter.
Nobuyuki BWAA: and I'm a little protective of my own ideas right now and was getting the impression you weren't intending on offering me anything more than superficial help
Nobuyuki BWAA: ah.
Nobuyuki BWAA: well right now I've started writing all my stuff from scratch
Nobuyuki BWAA: which is why I'm only making technology demos right now
Nobuyuki BWAA: I want to perfect all my new ideas
Nobuyuki BWAA: before I incorporate them into something
RealmRPGer: Yeah. Well, I know that trying to figure out how to write an avi would have been a major pain on my own. Turns out there's a dll or something that does it for you
Nobuyuki BWAA: that makes sense.
Nobuyuki BWAA: but uh
Nobuyuki BWAA: here we go again about talking about some unrelated thing
RealmRPGer: oh, sorry
RealmRPGer: I found it somewhat related..
Nobuyuki BWAA: do you do this often? sorry to pry
RealmRPGer: I suppose. I tend to sidetrack a lot
RealmRPGer: I'll come back on my own when I realize how far I've strayed
Nobuyuki BWAA: I'd feel less annoyed if I knew you had some sort of sociopathic disorder that made you always talk about some crap like everyone's interested about hearing it because it relates to you or something
Nobuyuki BWAA: sorry if that sounds rude btw
RealmRPGer: One of those "stream of consciousness" things or whatever. My thoughts all meld together with no start and end.
RealmRPGer: Actually, that's probably pretty accurate
RealmRPGer: I tend to be interested in most anything somebody has to say, as long as it's not too in-depth (like people talking all techy about bsd or maybe about football stats or blegh), so I probably naturally figure others are interested as well
RealmRPGer: Okay, I'll shut up now
Nobuyuki BWAA: okay. Listen. Sorry I had to go off on you like that, but you were seriously rubbing me the wrong way
Nobuyuki BWAA: you'd probably be much better off discussing spritewrite (if you even cared to in the first place, who knows) in the thread
Nobuyuki BWAA: then I can address your questions and interests more concisely
Nobuyuki BWAA: and more importantly, avoid sidetracking conversation derailments and segues
RealmRPGer: Yeah, alright